The dreaded day came. The day dh said that he wanted to take the kids camping. This brought dread to me for a couple of reasons: first, I’m not a camper. I’ve been camping before, even RVing, and yeah, it’s fun for the first day until the mosquitoes start biting and you try to sleep through the cacophony of bugs buzzing and wild animals rooting around your campground. And let’s not forget the sun rising at 4a. Second, dh wanted to rend an RV. Whoa! Deep breath. RVs are fun and provide a great home away from home when camping and traveling, but when you’re actually on the road, are they really safe for kids?
I agreed to take a field trip with dh to the RV store to look at the rental RVs to see how we could safely transport our 7 and 9 year old kids to the campground. We looked at 3 different RVs, all class C: 22′, 25′, and 30′. Class C RVs have a cut-away van chassis with a bunk over the cab, plus a bed in the back (and let’s not forget the bathroom!). Essentially an RV is a chassis, be it truck or van, with a box frame built on top of it. According to RV Consumer Group, the Class C is considered one of the safest because it has the van cockpit area intact: the driver and front passenger protection is there. They’re just the right size for a small family to get away for a weekend. On this camping trip, there will be 2 adults and 2 children: dh, MIL (um, did I mention I’m not fond of camping?), our 7 yr old harnessed in a Britax Frontier, and our 9 yr old in a booster seat because he’s too big for anything else (for you car seat people whose minds are whirring about possible car seat combinations 😉 ). In each RV, the only lap/shoulder belts are located in the front driver and passenger seats.
The 22′ RV has lap belts galore. There are 2 lap-only belts at the dinette table on the forward-facing side. Upon further investigation, the seat belt is bolted to a metal bar under the bench. The seat belt came from a couple inches forward of the bight (crack), which can pose serious install problems. Because the bench was completely surrounded by plywood, I couldn’t tell how the metal bar was secured to the vehicle. The cushion on the bench was removable, so there’s the potential for it to move around during a crash.
The other 3 seat belts are lap-only and found on the sideways-facing couch. The belts are bolted to the floor. Can you imagine sitting with your 2 best friends or family members buckled in sideways in a lap-only belt on the couch? No wonder no one wants to buckle up in these things.
The 25′ RV was set up nearly the same seat belt-wise except that instead of a couch, it had a single side-facing lounge chair with a lap-only belt.
The 30′ RV had 4 lap-only belts at the dinette with 2 on the rear-facing side facing the 2 on the forward-facing side. It also had a side-facing couch with 3 lap-only belts.
So the dilemma is where to put everyone in the 25′ RV, the one we feel best suits our needs. Given that dh is the driver and the only other position where a booster can safely be used is the front passenger seat, that’s where 9 yr old ds will go with the express instructions to not move, lol. He’s been well-versed in the dangers of airbags. Britax doesn’t allow installation of their restraints on side-facing or rear-facing vehicle seats, nor does any other car seat manufacturer (I checked with Britax and as long as the restraint is placed on a forward-facing vehicle seat and can be installed per the directions given in the user manual, installing in an RV is just fine). Given that restriction, dd will go at the dinette ASSUMING I can get a good installation of less than 1″ of movement at the belt path. The Frontier tends to be a, er, fussy seat to install under the best of circumstances; I’m not sure how it will do given what I have to work with on the dinette bench. MIL will sit in the side-facing chair in a lap-only belt (and I hope her head doesn’t collide with ds’s should a crash occur).
I would so love RVing to be the easy answer, but it’s not. Load up some food, throw the dog and kids in and go. If you got tired mid-trip, you laid on a bed and slept; if you got hungry, you made a sandwich. That’s the way it used to be before we got smart. I remember it being that way when I went RVing in the 70s with my dad and his family in the ol’ Winnebago. Unfortunately, there are some serious safety issues with RVs because of unrestrained passengers who can fly into each other in a crash (you’re 4 times more likely to be thrown from a vehicle if you’re unrestrained). A 40 lbs. child becomes a 2200 lbs. bullet in a 55 mph crash when he’s not buckled, so while it’s fun to run around and be free in the RV, it’s incredibly dangerous. And don’t forget about the luggage and other miscellaneous things laying around the cabin of the RV.
After we got all the logistics figured out, the RV was going to be $129/day + $0.32/mile + a fee to empty the tanks + gas + a per hour charge for the generator, if used. Insurance is included. In order to take possession, we would be required to pick up the afternoon before we needed it and return it the morning after returning home, thus incurring 2 extra days’ charges. Dh decided to find a nicer condo to rent for cheaper instead. With real beds. And a real shower. And internet. I may now go 🙂 .
Just a thought on lapbelts….I was using a booster seat with my child until I realized they are made for seatbelts with shoulder straps so that the cross-strap crosses correctly, not in front of their face or neck. I realized she was unstable being up higher, when without the booster, she had less chance of falling off the seat if she was sitting directly on it (such as when turning a corner or with a side-impact). I don’t know what if anything the law says about this, but my dinette does face forward & has seatbelts. I like to bring my dog with me, and I like to sleep in my own bed & not have to haul suitcases & gear into noisy motel rooms. I’ve been camping like this with kids since 1992 & it’s the only way for me!
JV- as with carseat use in general, the issue isn’t with those who use common sense and properly restrain their children. A quick bathroom break or dishes on a counter for a short time during a meal, for example, are not significant in the grand scheme of things.
The majority of fatalities are due to factors like non-use, being improperly restrained and factors like distracted/impaired driving. The problem is there are a lot of those out there, whether due to ignorance, neglect or other factors like perhaps older RVs where a child simply can’t be restrained correctly.
Glad to hear you’re having a good time, JV!
Well I also agree it’s a little OTT on safety with this thread. I’m about a month in travelling in our RV and I have to say it’s been the best vacation ever. Both dogs are with us and happy. My six year old son is very happy. Every day he asks ‘where are we going today?’ we’ve just done a tour of florida all the way down to the keys and are on our way up to Maine next. Then heading west around as many states as we can get to before we end up in California and our little mini couple month adventure is over. Safety is always a concern. My son knows to sit when the RV is in motion, however he will get up to go to the bathroom when he needs to ( no stopping and peeing in dirty rest stations! ) and then is right back in his seat and buckling up. Before we leave anywhere, EVERYTHING gets put away into cupboards and all surfaces are free of any debris that can ‘go flying like bullets’ or whatever. It’s common sense. Use it and you will be as safe as any other person on the road. Our dogs lay down behind the seats as that seems to be where they want to be as it is close to us and if we did crash they’d be leaned up against our chairs already. If we were that concerned we could also leash them to the base of the recliner chair as that has metal fixings into the floor of the RV. All in all it’s not as scary as you want to make it out to be. It is however, a ton of fun!
Jeez, some seriously paranoid views on this site. “Petrified of what was underneath our camper…” SERIOUSLY?! Did you think a chipmunk was gonna rip through the walls and eat you? I applaud your attempts to keep your children safe, but you have to understand that real safety comes from objectively assessing risk, not teaching our children to be terrified of everything. I’m guessing many of you spend an hour obsessing about the car seat install and then let your children eat at McDonalds. Your kid is more likely to die of cardiac disease or other nutrition related diseases than in a rv accident you take once a year on controlled access highways. Just make sure the car seats are properly anchored in a forward facing seat (never sideways) and make sure anything over 1lb is secured in a cabinet and not on a countertop. You’re forgetting that an RV may weigh upwards of 12-14,0000lbs. If you get in a crash with 95% of vehicles on the road, you’re gonna win the physics game. Plus you’re elevated well above the bumper line where vehicle intrusion causes many serious injuries. Don’t head on with a bus and you’ll be fine. Or you won’t, life’s full of risk, but obsessing about those risks will just make your children afraid to take chances and experience life. They’ll die at 90, miserably anxious and alone having never experienced anything fun. Assess the REAL risk based on facts, decide if you can live with those risks, and then mitigate the risks with proper preparation. Then sleep well knowing you’ve done what you can, within reason, and understand that worrying about the things you can’t control won’t keep them from happening.
Hi Keith, and thank you for your comments. I happen to think it is never paranoid to be concerned about transporting kids safely in motor vehicles of any kind. “Paranoid” means there is no actual risk of harm, only a belief. Yet, motor vehicle crashes continue to be the #1 cause of unintentional fatal harm to children. Far more than happy meals, I’m sad to say. It is the #1 preventable killer of kids 8 and under, so why dismiss any advice to protect children from it? And while you can rationalize away the risk one way or another, it shouldn’t be dismissed because you’re only in an RV for a limited time. That’s like saying it’s OK to leave the baby in the bath tub alone while you take a few minutes to check the oven (Drowning, #2 preventable cause) . Or leave the matches on the counter while while you go outside to check the Bar-B-Q (Fire, #3 cause). No way a curious preschool child can set a fire in 5 or 10 minutes, right?
RV’s are not immune to risk, especially those with inadequate restraint systems. While they may have an advantage of mass, how well are their structures and restraint systems tested for crashes or lay downs? You aptly mention how the passengers are elevated well above the bumper line. That means they have a greater disadvantage of a very high center of gravity combined with a relatively narrow axle track, losing a different physics game big time. And I doubt most RVs are equipped with stability control or rollover protection side curtain airbag systems to help mitigate the risk of deadly rollovers. And that’s a REAL risk based on facts. http://www.safercar.gov/Rollover.
Also, sometimes people do crash with buses, semis and other large vehicles. It happens. Maybe it’s a small risk you don’t mind, and that’s your choice of course. Maybe you have an RV where all your passengers are properly restrained for the whole trip, as they would be in a passenger vehicle, and that is commendable. But why feel the need to criticize other parents for being concerned about a REAL risk to their children? Do you really believe this type of normal parental concern for a child is going to cause harm? Sounds paranoid to me.
Sheryl, I agree that RVs are awesome for traveling, but they aren’t safe for families to travel in. There’s no safe place to install carseats and boosters, items aren’t tied down so they become projectiles in a crash, it’s more likely that when you get tired, you’re going to lay down in bed than rest your head against your seat while belted. I’d love to be able to take vacations in a motor home with my dog with us instead of being boarded in a kennel, but the safety side of me wins out. I’ve seen too many things on the road to let any of us, including the dog, go without seatbelts.
Sorry…I love our motor home! We sleep in our own bed, we eat great nutritional meals our entire vacation!! We spend so much more quality time together while rving we have fires every night, we play tons of games, go bike riding,.,.,. the list goes on and on. When we are in a hotel not one of those things happens. So quality family time is priceless to me and sorry but being able to sleep in my wonderful Tempurpedic bed is sooooo worth it 😉
Aw, good luck, Kebo. P.S. It’s really easy to fake being asleep when someone wants something ;).
I have no idea who you are, but your post/thread here was cathartic to say the least. Against my will I am loading up half, no 3/4 of my house, my 3 kids, and going with the novice Nomad (dh) for 5 days in some lady’s rv. I can’t tell you how much I want to scream. We went RVing when I was little and it was so fun. But now I’m grown up and NO THANK YOU! “Isn’t there another way???” I’m thinking. Apparently there isn’t. He has convinced himself and off we go.
In retrospect, it would be more fun if you didn’t have to take half the house, make sure the yucky floors and shower are sanitary (yuk yuk yuk) and if there was a smart solution to the car seat thing. Don’t get why RV’s are such a family thing if no one has taken the initiative to follow the law when it comes to transporting children! Makes no sense.
Plus- isn’t the idea- when you are a SAHM who constantly serves- to have someone ELSE cook for you, clean for you, and entertain your kids?? Just a thought.
Anyways, it’s nice that i am not the only one.;)
Sparky, how ’bout he drives the RV and you follow in the regualar vehicle?
Also, that way you have it for excursions/day trips.
If you wait long enough you’d even have extra drivers to trade off with, and teens old enough to take turns keeping him company in the RV…
Great job letting people know exactly WHY an RV is not safe for transporting children (or more than two people). Thanks H!
DH was fantasizing recently about going camping with an RV someday with our kids (when they’re older). Apparently I’m a big wet blanket because all I kept saying was how unsafe I thought it was what with only two proper seats and projectiles everywhere. He didn’t like me putting a downer on his dreaming. Plus he just thinks I’m crazy because he thinks the chance of getting in a collision or some such thing in one is super slim. Not that he has any evidence to back that up… but I don’t have any to prove they are unsafe either. Just logic. And a car safety obsession. Ah well. We’re a few years away from arguing that one out for real. Can’t wait.
lap belts, potential projectiles everywhere, no real good places to install a CR, whoa, this sounds like every car seat geek’s worst nightmare of a vehicle and we haven’t even started discussing the fuel consumption and vehicle dynamics/handling that would make a minivan or a huge SUV seem like an Indy car by comparison =:-O
So glad you and DH agreed on the condo alternative – you’ve saved us all from vicarious seat-install nightmares. And (having been stuck behind RV’s en route to Yosemite and Yellowstone on a few occasions) I’ll bet anyone driving behind you on your way to your destination will also be glad that you’re not RVing 😉
Tent camping– yes.
Trailer camping– maybe.
RVing– not until/unless we’re retired people travelling alone! They’re really only designed to carry 2 people safely, IMO.
Yeah, I gave up camping the last time we went specifically to look at the Perseids (it was cloudy). Dh–then boyfriend–was sound asleep while I laid there petrified, listening to whatever was underneath our camper, rooting around and making grunting and snuffling noises. I was waiting for the huge bear shadow to rear up on the side wall! :O
Dh’s favorite TV show of the year is the annual RV Show on HGTV. We’ve both decided that if we ever do buy one (hahahahahahahahaha!), it would be a 5th wheel. Some of those are soooooo nice! Plus you have the added advantage of everyone riding safely in a truck. And it gives me happy memories of The Long, Long Trailer. 😉
We did briefly consider adding a hitch to one of our vehicles, but I said no way, not for 1 camping trip. [shaking head] He was trying.
That’s why we have a Suburban and MIL has a tow-behind fifth wheel camper. 😉
I’m relieved to see the condo rental resolution at the end of your blog article, whew, and that’s more in line with my idea of camping, too. 🙂 The most “rustic” I’ve gone is an Amish built log cabin at a campground. Said cabin has A/C, bathroom with hot and cold running water, electricity, TV, and wireless Internet. We’re probably spending the night there again soon with the kids. 🙂
My family goes camping fairly frequently. For years now we’ve had a trailer, which was towed by a Suburban and is now towed by a 4 door full size truck. I like the vehicle+trailer combo better than a motorhome for more than just safety reasons. If you’re going to stay somewhere more than one night, you can disconnect and take the smaller vehicle elsewhere which allows you to go on more roads (4WD) and uses less gas.
Oh thank goodness this story has a happy ending! I was working myself into a panic just thinking about you guys in an RV. For the record – I LOVE camping. I take the kids tent camping at least once or twice every summer. The bugs, rustic bathrooms and potential bear sightings don’t scare me at all. But traveling in a flimsy, boxed living room at 60 mph with multiple projectiles at every angle… I shudder at the mere thought.
It’s funny how you read several people talk about how unsafe the vehicles are. How they would never let their kids in one and how these RVs are only for two people that only sit in the front seat. But I bet there are several people reading this who have there kids strapped in the rear of their car with only the quick LATCH system that is only rated for 40-50 lbs.
Use car or booster seats strapped to a front or rear facing seat.
Make sure it’s as tightly installed as your car
Only use sofa if it’s a last option.
Here’s the best one.
Drive the speed limit!! Use common sense. Don’t drive like an a*hole. It’s not a Miata. You basically driving a school bus full of kids. Treat it like one. Keep your distance. Allow plenty of time. Think how hard it is to stop a train.
Have fun and enjoy it. I’d rather stay in my trailer than the hotel any day. If you really want to know just google “black light hotel”
I know where my beds been. Do you?